BY KALI CROKE, FOX News
BOSTON, Mass. (Fox News) — A working paper in the Disarmament and International Security Committee (DISEC) sponsored by France, Spain and Portugal has permitted United Nations Peacekeepers to infiltrate national governments.
Accused of being an abuse of Article 34 of the United Nations Charter that allows the Security Council to investigate threats to international security, the clause states that the “UNCPO… disguise themselves” and “infiltrate the target country.” FOX News sat down with the delegate of France for further comment.
FOX: Tell me about the “Undercover Peacekeeping Operations”.
France: My first question is, what needs to be defended?
FOX: The Undercover Peacekeeping Operations. Nations are concerned about their infringement on national sovereignty.
France: The short answer is that it’s not the case. Article 34 of the UN Charter says that the Security Council should have an investigative wing to look into international disputes and things that cause conflict.
FOX: So that means spies?
France: So that means some sort of investigative wing. This is how we are choosing to implement it. It’s not an abuse because there’s no implementation of it currently, and this is the only implementation proposed. Not only are we fighting terrorism, we are also filling the mandate of the UN Charter.
FOX: Putting spies into governments, that’s a fulfillment of the UN Charter?
France: No there are no spies into governments at any part of this.
FOX: So what would you call the UNPCO that are covert and not known to the government?
France: They are known to the government, the UNSC votes to deploy them so every country knows because Security Council meetings are public. Additionally they are under the UN Peacekeeping Operations. And just like those, countries have to agree to the UN Covert Peacekeeping.
FOX: So you amended your original clause?
France: No, that’s how it’s always been.
FOX: I have a copy.
[Clause 7a: “Infiltrate the target country without letting national or local governments become aware of UNCPO identities, especially if the terrorist organization is state-sponsored.”]
France: We don’t want the individual identities of the UNCPO agents known, but we do want the governments to know. The overarching thing is that countries know when they are being deployed.
FOX: So what makes you think countries will allow it? If I’m a government that sponsors terrorism, I don’t want you there.
France: If they allow it they will be less suspicious on our scale of terrorist involvement.
FOX: So if Syria allows, it we are not going to be suspicious?
France: In terms of terrorist involvement, we are going to be less suspicious.
FOX: Of Syria?
France: Uh, yes. Of Syria. Right, right. So that part is the TICS that we have — the Terrorist Involvement Classification System.
FOX: But what about civilians? Do you think they will feel comfortable if this gets out that the government is accepting international spies among their population?
France: Um… yes. It doesn’t really concern civilians.
FOX: Why not? They have spies walking among them. And some could be terrorists.
France: Tell that to the NSA and the United States Surveillance programs.
FOX: Oh, I will. Trust me.
France: Look, at the end of the day. This is targeted at the terrorist organizations. It’s not at the people. In TICS, have a way to distinguish someone that’s bringing a baguette to a terrorist meeting and someone that is committing acts of terror. There is a very clear scale. So civilians aren’t involved in this and governments aren’t involved in this. We aren’t looking at government action, we aren’t looking at government abuses.
FOX: Wait, but I thought you were? You’re sending them through the government to make sure that the government is not involved.
France: We’re looking at the terrorist organizations.
FOX: So you’re looking at civilians?
France: We are looking at the terrorist organizations.
FOX: Who are not part of the government, who are not civilians, so they are…
FOX: Okay, and before they were terrorists, they were…
FOX: Okay so they are civilians.
France: Sorry, I don’t quite draw the parallel. At the end of the day we have a distinguishment between bystander civilians and the terrorists.
FOX: So you know who the terrorists are? Why send spies if you know who they are? You know they’re not civilians, you know they’re not government. Who is left over?
France: The UNCPO. The first is to locate the terrorists and understand their leadership structure. If we already know where the terrorists are, then we would tell you. We don’t. Part of that is figuring it out, their location.
FOX: So you have to look among civilians for them…
France: Oh, I see your point. So you’re saying the problem is that the UNCPO is going to be talking to civilians?
FOX: Yes, spies walking among civilians. To figure out the terrorists, of course. But there are still spies walking among civilians.
France: Sure but we are in the United Nations it would be silly to think that none of the people here are spies.
France: Like are you suggesting that it impacts a civilians life to have a spy walking among them?
FOX: If affects their perception of personal privacy, sure.
France: If I’m walking around and lets say I’m a spy — who knows, I could be — and I’m a spy and I work at a Starbucks and you buy coffee from me, how does that impact your life?
FOX: What if I’m buying coffee and a baguette and you now think I’m a terrorist on my way to a terrorist meeting?
France: Right, so then you’d be considered a sympathizer, or a passive member. We are only looking for people involved in the organization.
FOX: Okay. But among civilians.
France: Listen, the world is not black and white. At the end of the day there are many shades of gray.
FOX: Except when you know that a terrorist is a civilian or a government. Then there are two shades.
France: Still a scale. The spies in the the concern with privacy is that any civilian not engaged in terrorism don’t interact with them. Except they might come into contact with them, and so long as they are not engaging with the organization then they’ll move on.